The Storage Report - NYC wants to cap rental rates; plus what is happening in housing?

THE SELF STORAGE REPORT — EPISODE TRANSCRIPT Episode: The Storage Report - NYC wants to cap rental rates; plus what is happening in housing? Guest: Thaddeus Campbell — host of the Defining Your Niche podcast, Safe Storage USA and Flex Park Partners Host: Chris Berg — Abernathey Development Recorded: June 6, 2025 Video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RGaKEW6gE44 Key topics: New York City Council bills capping self storage rent increases at 2% annually; Stan Bonia and the New York Self Storage Association; California SB 79 and its 10.5%-or-CPI hybrid cap; Gary Sugarman, William Warren Group and the California Self Storage Association's $61 million K-12 funding argument; Storage Cafe's $237 billion US market value versus New York's $22.5 billion; the $1 billion-plus Manhattan Mini Storage acquisition; ECRI and REIT discounting strategies; New York City square feet per capita at one sixth the national average; a second bill controlling lease language and evictions; 6.1 million Americans behind on their mortgages; 500,000 more sellers than buyers, a record since 2013; Lennar's September 19, 2024 peak on Powell's first rate cut; Philip J. Anderson's 18.5 year real estate cycle and Henry George's single land tax. Note: Speaker attribution reconstructed from raw captions. Light cleanup of transcription errors only; wording preserved. Timestamps and YouTube chapter markers removed. Turns marked [attribution inferred] could not be attributed with certainty. ————————————————————————————— Thaddeus Campbell: Hello and welcome to the inaugural edition of the Self Storage Report. I am so excited to be here today. My name is Thaddeus Campbell. I am with Safe Storage USA and Flex Park Partners, the host of the Defining Your Niche podcast. Chris Berg: I'm Chris Berg, looking for land — land acquisition for Avenue Holdings. We're building self storage in California and Arizona. Also host of the CRE Report. Today we're going to be talking about a couple of really interesting topics that matter to self storage. One, uh, in California we just beat down the idea of capping rental rates. Now New York City wants to cap rental rates. Wait till you hear where they want to cap that — could destroy the biggest self-storage market in the country. Um, also the housing market. There's some record numbers right now happening with the disparity in the housing market, which we'll explain here in just a moment. Thaddeus Campbell: Yeah, want to dive right in, Chris. And first of all, just let me say thank you for agreeing to join. When I met you back at ISS in April, I knew there was going to be a connection there that we were able to draw off of. So, really excited to do this show with you and thanks for agreeing to come on and be my co-host with this. Looking forward to doing some great things and, quite frankly, filling a niche that I think our industry really needs, which is up-to-date news on what's going on in the industry that's easily accessible. Chris Berg: Dude, nice pun with your podcast, brother. [Laughter] Thaddeus Campbell: I love it. I didn't even try. I'm going to have to go back and watch that to see what I did. But let's dig in, because there's something that came up this past week. I had a conversation with Stan Bonia and we're going to hear directly from Stan, um, board member of the New York Self Storage Association, very attuned to what's going on nationwide in the industry, but specifically in New York. They introduced legislation in the city council. This happened because a council member has a mother who rented self storage. I'm not going to say the name of the company that she rented from. I will say that it's a company that is very synonymous with the idea of ECRI and discounting price strategies. And this mother of one of the council women signed up for a storage unit at X dollars and 6 months later was at 3 or 4x on her price, brought it up to her daughter who's the council woman in New York City. And this led to some legislation being introduced. And I'm going to let this come straight from the mouth of Stan Bonia. You can hear what he had to say. Stan Bonia (recorded clip): On my desk today from New York City Council, a new bill. It goes to, uh, similar to the California 708 bill. This one is, um, trying but much more aggressive. New York City wants to cap rent increases by 2% annually. Stan Bonia (recorded clip) [attribution inferred]: California SB — it's SB79 — and they were going to cap rent originally in that bill, but it was going to be like 10.5%. It wasn't going to be like an onerous cap, right? And that's a hybrid. It's 10.5% or X over the CPI, whichever is lower, right? Okay. So, it could have been lower than 10% but not more than 10.5%. Right? This one they're saying, let's cap it at 2%. And by the way, if you're going to stop raising my real estate taxes by no more than 2% and cap utility and payroll by 2%, okay. But otherwise, you're going to put everyone out of business very, very quickly. Stan Bonia (recorded clip, replaying): On my desk — Thaddeus Campbell: Stan Bonia. How did I run that twice? Let me get rid of that somehow. I don't know how to get rid of that, Chris. Chris Berg: No worries. While you figure that out, I just want to then talk about this. So, what's really fascinating about capping rental rates at 2%, two things important to mention. Um, Storage Cafe recently put out a report suggesting, hey, the total market value of self storage right now in the United States is about $237 billion. The number one market in the US is New York City at about — Stan Bonia (recorded clip, replaying): — desk today from New York City Council. A new bill. It goes to — Chris Berg: I think we need a new producer. About 20. Thaddeus Campbell: We do. We need a new director here. I got to figure out how to get rid of this thing. Chris Berg: So, New York City comes in at a total market value of $22.5 billion. So, it's roughly like 10% of the total market value across the United States. Here's my point. You start capping rental rates at 2%, you're going to decimate that market. I mean, it's going to be game over for those owners. We all know about the big acquisition that took place, over a billion dollars, right, for the Manhattan Mini Storage. I mean, that investment is going to struggle with this. Now, here's what I want to talk about. You and I mentioned this on your podcast when we spoke about SB79, is that what I would encourage the people in New York — I just had a podcast this morning with Tom D. Young, who you may know from Colliers, been in the business for 18 years. We talked about this. I think it's critically important that the coalition in New York does what California did, and that was say, okay, look, you want to put in these caps on rental rates, that's one conversation to have. And let me just share with you, if they were to do that in California, the coalition in California said you're going to lose out on $61 million a year just in K-12 funding. That doesn't include the other property tax revenue. So my point being is I don't know a lot of politicians that are willing — you mentioned this was from one constituent, right? One anecdote. I don't know a lot of politicians that are willing to go out there and basically commit political suicide over one constituent when you're going to lose out on potentially 60 or 100 or whatever that number is, and knowing that, again, New York City the largest market, cap value of $22.5 billion. You start lowering the assessed values there, it could be some pretty big numbers and a big, big loss of tax revenue. Thaddeus Campbell: I'm going to show this for you. Just throw this up, that you put this on your LinkedIn earlier this week. This is from Storage Cafe and it's showing $22 billion, the New York, New Jersey, uh, New York, Jersey City market, the biggest by almost double over Los Angeles, which is a robust storage market and still pales in comparison to New York City. I want to add in here that this was not the only piece of legislation introduced in New York City. They had a second bill that was aiming to allow the city to control the writing of all leases for self storage rentals. And one of the things that was going to be written into the new lease agreements was that you were not allowed to kick out a tenant for anything other than lack of payment of rent. Think about the doors that that opens to somebody to be able to use their storage units for something that has a detrimental effect on the overall facility and you as the owner are handcuffed. So why are we bringing this up? Stan Bonia, from his own mouth: I'd be remiss in not saying, you know, these are not going to have very strong legs. These two bills the way they're written are very unlikely to move forward in the New York City Council. That being said, Chris, I want to pick your brain a little bit. What does it mean that we're even seeing these bills be written in the first place? That self storage is on the tongues of city council people in New York, state senator who introduced SB79, right? SB, Senate bill, uh, in California. Chris Berg: So, two things I want to share there. And you're right, you took one of my lines, is, hey, we want to keep this industry off the lips of legislators, number one. And then secondly, I was at a great event, um, in LA yesterday morning and this came up in regards to SB79. And again, you being in the media industry in the past, myself as well, we've seen the political gamesmanship forever. I think this first pass at 79, 77, SB79, was just sort of a first pass to go, okay, let's see how they respond, right? Like this guy said yesterday at the event, look, just because they tried this and failed doesn't mean they're not going to come back and try to get a bite of the apple again in the future. And so I think that's what's really important for people in this industry to realize is, um, hey, they tried it once, but I think there's going to be a time where they come back and try to take another bite of the apple and you got to be prepared to, again, defend your position. I think the CSSA did a great job showing the lower tax revenues and that that speaks volumes in Sacramento and other state capitals. I, credit to Gary Sugarman and, you know, uh, William Warren Group — StoreQuest is their brand name. I mean, he deserves a lot of credit for getting that coalition to the California Self Storage Association and really not attacking the bill, but showing what are going to be the side effects of the bill, right? And, you know, to your point, and I know that Stan Bonia and the other members, Guy Middlebrooks, who's on the New York Self Storage Association board, the vice president at CubeSmart, they have some very, very sharp minds on their board as well, and I know that they'll attack that in a way that is intelligent. Thaddeus Campbell: I guess my point being as we dive into this topic a little deeper is, you know, I can remember being at the New York SSA's investors forum, which, for all of you guys watching, for my money, the most informative event that happens in self storage. It is a one-day event in Manhattan in January every year hosted by NYSSA. Unbelievable coalition of high-level people in the industry. Um, if you can get to that event, it is well worth the time and energy to go. I first heard the term ECRI at that event January 1st, 2023, over 2 full years ago now. Um, and I can remember here, excuse me, January 1st, 2024, 18 months ago. Um, and can remember they had all 5 REITs sitting up on the stage together, vice presidents of all the REITs. Um, and they all talked about ECRI and how they were here to stay, how they were going to use this discounting strategy and the existing customer rate increases as a way that worked, right? Using algorithms to run their price increases, and that it was working. And so I guess my question is, yeah, maybe they think it worked from a financial standpoint, but what's the danger of employing a strategy like that long term where you open yourself to what's going on now, where all of a sudden one mom talks to her daughter who happens to be a politician and the backlash could be fatal for the New York City self storage, uh, industry. Chris Berg: Such a great point. Love how you set that up. And I think secondly, the other piece that we haven't talked about, and again, Tom D. Young brought this to the presence yet today in the podcast I did with him, is the fact that look, if you really think you're out there fighting for your constituents, which most politicians are going to say they are, the reality is, and the last 2.5 years bears this out to be true with the data, is that the free market works. You know, year-over-year for the last 2.5 years in self storage, the pricing has actually gone down. And so I think if you're really trying to save your constituents money, let the free market work, number one. And number 2, the other good point that Tom D. Young made today is the fact that when the rumors came up about SB79, what happened in California, everyone started raising the rates. Everyone raised the rates. So now you're taking away these promo rates on these 30-day agreements for your constituents, for our customers, that eventually could help force them to pay more money down the road. Anyway, so I just hope that, you know, if you're in a position of power that you can start to lay down some laws that you really think about your constituents and what's best for them, and more often than not it's typically the free market. Thaddeus Campbell: I love your idealism and thinking that there are going to be politicians in America who are thinking logically. That is a fantastic — I prefer to go a little bit the different way. I call myself a pragmatic idealist and I would just urge people in our industry, I'm going to throw up a couple of graphics here. I want to show, to your point about the free market works, right? So this is, you can see a 1-year and a 5-year of Public Storage, and you can obviously see 2021 into 2022 you saw the boom of COVID. And look, let's not pretend that storage is not a necessary part of the American economy. It is absolutely something that many, many people in our country utilize, not just to store their junk. People run their businesses out of these storage units. People that are doing eBay type businesses, Etsy type businesses, you know, they store high-end equipment there. This is a critical use for citizens of our country. We see what happened during COVID when people were moving out of their offices. They needed to create space in their homes. Their kids were home from school. Their kids needed a place to go online for school, and they were utilizing storage as a way to store that stuff that they didn't want to throw out because they knew that they were probably going to go back to work at some point. So, we're not talking about something that isn't a necessary part of our economy, but you saw how the free market operated, right? When there was that increased spike in need during COVID, you saw the value of self storage rates went up, right? This is, uh, Public Storage. I'm going to throw up Extra Space for a minute. You can see a very similar curve. And then as things started to die down for COVID and people had less need for that storage, you saw the rates dropped and their stock prices dropped the same way. CubeSmart, I'll throw the third biggest REIT up there. Very, very similar trajectory to the other two. So the point I'm trying to make is to reinforce your point that the free market will dictate what the price of something is. What I feel very strongly is that as an industry we want to make sure that we don't employ tactics that are going to invite politicians to come and put a sharper eye on us. Chris Berg: Well, one thing that has not been talked about, that if I was in a politician's seat on a city planning commission, county commission, really, if you want to do what's right for constituents from a pricing perspective, put more zoning in for storage because that's just going to add the supply. And no one's having that conversation right now. And again, many people may not like that, but that is the reality if you're in a political seat. Um, and then watch what happens and see if, you know, developers come in and build or not. Thaddeus Campbell: Once again, you're asking for logic from — I love it. I love the idealism and I listen to your point, you know, these same politicians that are asking for restrictions on, you know, how we raise prices, in a lot of instances will deny self storage as a, as a, you know, a facility to be built in certain areas. And 100% that restriction, which is quite frankly why New York City is such an amazing market for self storage, because the square foot per capita is like one sixth of what it is nationally. So you just have such a restricted supply that prices are through the roof. But one last thing I do want to ask, so you brought it up and I've been saying this for a while and I think it's a really powerful piece, again, for politicians to understand, because a lot of them are like, hey, self storage doesn't do a lot for sales tax and things like that. Chris Berg [attribution inferred]: Well, remember, and Thad just mentioned this, you want to really start to look at self storage, especially what's going on today with all these Gen Xers and 1099 people. Um, we are really an entrepreneurial incubator. That's how I see storage. We are an incubator for entrepreneurs where maybe they want to take on, you know, a 1-year lease at a more industrial type of storage place. Here, they can do month-to-month, test out their Amazon business, the RSI business. Hey, is there actually a market fit here? But they're not stuck with this lease that may end up burying them from a credit report standpoint or whatever. So, um, I hope that more and more people in those positions of political power can realize like, hey, we're really doing a service for your community by allowing these small business owners to get into business inexpensively and, um, test out their business thesis. Chris Berg: To your point, as I've been doing a bunch of research, a lot of people know that I'm getting into the small bay industrial flex space as well as self storage. And in doing research in that space, one of the things I looked at is the percentage of small businesses that exist in our country in 2025 going back 40 years ago versus 1985. And the per capita number of small businesses in America has gone up by 2.5 times in 40 years. There are 2.5 times more people embarking on that entrepreneurial journey. So to your point, and we know this, storage units are used very strongly. Small businesses are almost a third of the storage business. Thaddeus Campbell: Fantastic transition, Chris, and I'm glad you brought it up and I want to throw this back to you because the biggest driver of self storage has always been and probably always will be people moving. And we know that for the last couple years, the housing market has been, to call it stagnant might be a little bit of an understatement. It has been moving slowly. So, I want to pitch it to you and I want to get into a conversation about some things that you're seeing in the housing market and what we should be paying attention to. Chris Berg: Well, just came out today, and I don't know if I'm savvy enough technology-wise to actually put this graphic — Thaddeus Campbell: You can't do any worse than I did with the graphics. Chris, you can't do any worse. [Laughter] Anything, directors out there that know how to direct a news program, because Chris and I could use it. Chris Berg: But there is, um, pretty interesting data around, and again we'll see if I can somehow figure this out. Let you tell me if you can actually see this. Thaddeus Campbell [attribution inferred]: But I see it. Yes. Chris Berg [attribution inferred]: I pulled this off. There you go. Um, but there is — Thaddeus Campbell [attribution inferred]: Now can you get rid of it? That's the question. Chris Berg: The biggest discrepancy, if you will, or the biggest margin of home sellers versus buyers really since they started keeping track of this, apparently in 2013. So, I think you and I both know, hey, there's this pent up demand, but at the same point in time, who wants to get rid of their house when they're in it for 2.65 or 3% mortgage rate. Um, and for most people right now, they just can't afford to buy a home. So, something's going to give here. When that happens, I don't know how that happens. I don't know. All I do know is that when it does give, it's going to be a very, very good sign for self storage. Thaddeus Campbell: So, I guess here's the question I would throw back at you and I'd love to get your thoughts on it and really kind of understand. Well, I'm going to throw up a graphic real quick. All right, let me see if I can. This is something that I got from our friend Tyler Sers at Cactus AI, put this on his, um, his LinkedIn a couple days ago. This is 6.1 million Americans behind on their mortgage. The highest in 20 years, since before 2008, which is hard to imagine. And this is Tyler's writing. He put "Brace for impact." He was going for the news style effect. But listen, if there's 6.1 million people behind on their mortgages in the United States, it makes sense that there are so many houses going on the market, right? Because it doesn't matter if your interest rate is at 3.5% but you're 3 months behind on your mortgage and the bank is sending you letters, you're going to sell the house. The question becomes, with 500,000 less buyers than there are sellers, are there enough people that can absorb that inventory in order to solve that problem? And this is going to be very interesting to play out. I know you and I have talked about this a lot. We are two of the, I don't want to say few, because Philip J. Anderson wrote an amazing book called The Secret Life of Real Estate and Banking and there's a bunch of people that have read it, but it's certainly not like a mainstream book that people have read. Um, and it talks about the 18.5 year real estate cycle. And so I want to kind of get your thoughts on, what do you see happening here? Do you see, with these things that we're seeing in the housing market, do you see a loosening and more sales or do you see, hey, we might be headed into, uh, you know, one of those steep declines that we see every roughly 20 years in the economy. Chris Berg: I think we're definitely heading that direction. When that happens and what's going to be the catalyst to that? I don't know. The housing market though has got its issues where as long as rates stay this high, and I saw another great post recently about this, is that as long as rates stay this high it diminishes the value of the home because people can't buy as much house, right? So as long as there's a sort of bid-ask spread that I think currently is happening with some sellers, there's going to be issues. But the point of that post I shared earlier and what you're sharing is I think that's starting to change. And I say that because there was an anecdotal story even in California where a guy listed his house at, I think it was 35, ended up transacting at like, you know, 5, right? So clearly dramatic drop in what he sold that for. So as long as sellers start to realize like, hey, when rates are this high people can't afford as much home, I'm going to have to lower the pricing here. And some sellers I think will be willing, especially if you're behind on your mortgage you're probably going to be willing to do that. I think one other, two other things I will throw into this conversation, I want to get your thoughts on, is one, you've also got the student loan situation coming back on the table where, you know, that was getting kicked down the can under the different administration that we had in the past. Now, those student loan debts are coming due and you're talking another $600 a month coming out of disposable income. That's a big chunk of money if you're new to the job market, right? So, that's one thing. The second piece though that I see your data point, but what's also interesting because of COVID, and maybe this is more of like the top 20% of income earners, but the United States American household balance sheets have never been stronger. I mean, there is a lot of balance sheets with a lot of cash hidden on them. Thaddeus Campbell: Yeah. Yeah. I think this is a fascinating thing to talk about and so where do we go with the housing market, right? Because one of the things we saw pre-COVID was private equity getting into buying single family residential homes for long-term rentals. So the question becomes, do we see individual buyers, the quote unquote American dream? And we know that millennials and Gen Z have been a little less likely to commit to a single home. They've kind of been a little bit more at ease with that nomadic lifestyle. Does that process change or do we see a shift back to, I can remember when Warren Buffett said it in the 2010s where he said the single best investment you can make is a single family home because you could get a mortgage at 4.5, at that time it was like 4.5, 5%, got down all the way into the 2.5s, you know, 3s. Um, do we see private equity eating up those houses or do we see it going to regular people? Either way, does it open a pathway to where we see more movement again, right? We see people moving in a way that helps the self-storage industry. Chris Berg: I think we're definitely going to continue to see movement. I think you bring up a great point about Gen Z. They like that more nomadic lifestyle. So, you know, is there a situation where maybe you put a group of Gen Zers together and they buy 2 or 3 homes across the country and that's how they start to move around? I mean, you know, I don't know how that's going to all plan out, but I think also you've got a huge amount of inventory coming on from the homebuilders because you see them buying down rates and doing things there. Um, the margins in the home, call up a couple of, uh, the margins in the homebuilder stocks are collapsing right now. And so, I think you just want to be privy to how is that going to play out as they continue to build, but there's just not enough buyers with now all this other added inventory coming online. Thaddeus Campbell: This is something you brought to my attention that I thought was a perfect time to bring up. This is Lennar. I got a couple of the other major home builders as well. You brought this to my attention. The peak for Lennar was September 19th of 2024. And I'll let you take — and you can see the slow growth through COVID, peaked out around $180 and then a steep drop back down. You can tell me because I didn't know. You asked me what was special about September 19, 2024. I'm going to let you tell me. Chris Berg: It's really fascinating and I wish I could show you again on my screen, but you've done a great job here with these graphics. So if you look at September 19th, and if you can kind of clip through Lennar, maybe KB Homes, and there's, um, another one, but that was the all-time high for these homebuilder stocks, was September 19th. And I'll ask our audience, do you remember what happened on September 19th, 2024? I'm going to presume that you don't. And what happened was that was the first time Powell lowered rates. So, I think it's very fascinating. You can go back and look at these stocks, but September 19th literally is the ATH, all-time high. It's the exact same day that Powell lowered rates. Now, what does that mean? I don't have the exact tie. All I do know is you got to think about it. Powell's lowering rates. Why is he doing that? The economy is probably not clipping along like he'd like to see it. So, he's going to try and juice the thing a little bit. Thaddeus Campbell: I thought that was so fascinating because I was, you know, when you asked me, when you said September 19th was the day they drop rates, it seems so the opposite of what I thought would happen to home builders when you drop interest rates, right? Because ostensibly, if you drop interest rates, people can afford a higher price for their house. Chris Berg: To go back to what you said about Philip J. Anderson and his book and his thesis, he said the same thing back in, I think it was early '24 into '23, is like most people are going to see these rates going up and think that the homebuilders aren't going to do as well. The exact opposite happened. So, you know, again, his thesis, I think, at least what I've seen has been pretty accurate. So it is counterintuitive. Um, and that is if you listen to the mainstream media, but again, this is why I would encourage people, if you haven't heard about Henry George, read about Henry George. If you're not familiar with the impact of land, so Henry George was an economist back in the late 1800s, very famous, was going to run for the mayor of New York. His premise was, hey, we could do a single tax on land and eradicate every other tax. So, he's got a great thesis around rent takes all the gains, land takes all the gains. If you know Peter Thiel, big VC guy, done extremely well in Facebook and PayPal with Elon Musk, he's going about the country as of late and talking about Henry George and how rent takes all the gains, excuse me, land takes all the gains as well. So, I share that because I think it's a really interesting thesis to look at, especially here we are talking about storage and real estate. If you're not privy to it, um, you'll do yourself a favor, I think, by getting educated. Thaddeus Campbell: Chris, man, I, you know, we've really dove deeply into these two topics that I absolutely wanted to make sure that we got some serious discussion about. Obviously, you know, fingers crossed the legislation that was introduced in New York City doesn't go anywhere, but to your point, we know that in politics, once something like this gets to be a hot button, you tend to have it cycle back and come around. The same thing with SB 709 in California, which we certainly want to keep our eye on. Kudos to Gary Sugarman for his work out in California of making sure that the more onerous parts of that bill were ultimately left out of what ended up passing through committee. I know Stan Bonia and the crew at the New York SSA board of directors, they're on top of things there as well and making sure that they're monitoring there. A fascinating thing with the housing market, I didn't even get to talk about May. There was a 7% decline in the price of new homes versus May of 2024. So there's some fascinating information going on. I want to say what I said at the beginning, Chris, so thankful that you agreed to come on and host this with me. I feel honored to have someone as media savvy as you are and with the track record you have to be able to join this with me. And quite frankly looking forward, and please anybody that's watching, if you got something of value for our half hour, put it in the comments. Let us know. This is something that I think, and I'll let you share your thoughts, but I certainly see us doing more frequently. Chris Berg: Yeah. I just want to say thank you. You know, I mean, this was kind of, you called me up. You're like, "Hey, I think I got an idea. Let's do this news thing. There's a niche." Again, pun to your podcast, but I think there's a niche there that we could fill to really help educate that space and keep the news prominent and prevalent to people. And so, uh, you know, big kudos to you and thank you for reaching out. I really had a great time the last, whatever, 27, 28 minutes. I hope we can continue to do this. And, um, just, you know, a great marketing mentor of mine that once said, hey, he who educates the market dominates the market. And so I just hope that you and I can continue to provide some great value to people and, um, help educate. So appreciate it. Thaddeus Campbell: Looking forward to the journey and, as I said at the beginning, I think this is something that our industry can really benefit from and I know for you and I it's super powerful because when you present the news you learn the news and you have to get yourself educated on what's going on. And there's no better way to force yourself to get educated than go live in front of people for a half hour and have to show like you actually know what you're talking about. So listen, as we did on our podcast episode that we taped a couple weeks ago, not, you know, we're not just here to read the news by any stretch of the imagination. We're gonna laugh. We're gonna have some fun. Um, and hopefully you guys out there get something of value from it with us. We're going to have a good time one way or the other. That's it for this episode of the Storage Report. I am Thaddeus Campbell, host of the Defining Your Niche podcast, Safe Storage USA and Flex Park Partners. And he is — I tried to do that seamlessly. I should have warned you. And he is — Chris Berg: Dude, did I have like — oh, wrong. Was that, was — Thaddeus Campbell: That's where you're supposed to sign off, Chris. That's where you're supposed to sign off. Chris Berg: Oh, man. Thaddeus Campbell: Chris Berg, thank you for joining us. We'll definitely be doing more of these and, uh, God bless. Chris Berg: The blooper reels are going to be phenomenal. Have a great day, everybody. — END OF TRANSCRIPT —